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Thread: Porn up Rape down

  1. #1
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    Porn up Rape down

    In a paper just released in the United States titled Porn Up, Rape Down, Northwestern University Law Professor Anthony D’amato crunches the numbers to reach the conclusion:

    The incidence of rape in the United States has declined 85 per cent in the past 25 years while access to pornography has become freely available to teenagers and adults. The Nixon and Reagan Commissions tried to show that exposure to pornographic materials produced social violence. The reverse may be true: that pornography has reduced social violence.

    Professor D’amato explains that the Internet is now the predominant way in which people access pornography, noting that purveyors of internet pornography in the US earn an annual income exceeding the total of the major media networks in the country.

    The main point that Professor D’amato highlights in his paper is that there is a positive correlation between the recent explosion of household internet access in the US, and a decline in incidents of rape (measured in different ways, including police reports and survey interviews) during the same period.

    According to Professor D’amato, the four US states with the lowest internet access had the highest increase in rape incidents (53 per cent increase) between 1980 and 2004, whereas the four states with the highest internet access, experienced the largest decrease in rape incidents (27 per cent decrease).

    Professor D’amato suggests there are two predominant reasons why an increase in the availability of pornography has led to a reduction in rape. First, using pornographic material provides an easy avenue for the sexually desirous to “get it out of their system”.

    Second, D’amato points to the so-called “Victorian effect”. This dates back to the old Victorian era where people covered up their bodies with an immense amount of clothing, generating a greater mystery as to what they looked like naked. D’amato suggests that the free availability of pornography since the 1970s, and the recent bombardment of internet pornography, has de-mystified sex, thus satisfying the sexually curious.
    http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=4845

  2. #2
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    Very interesting. I wonder what some of our religious folk have to say about this.
    "They keep talking about drafting a Constitution for Iraq. Why don't we just give them ours? It was written by a lot of really smart guys, it's worked for over 200 years, and [heck], we're not using it anymore."
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  3. #3
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    Just wait until I propose the ultimate solution...consenting adult theme parks!

    If you think the bible-thumpers won't tar and feather me...
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim's trucking View Post

    If you think the bible-thumpers won't tar and feather me...
    Nah - just tell them you LIKE it like that...
    “But who prays for Satan? Who, in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most? ” ~ Mark Twain

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  5. #5
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    The incidence of rape in the United States has declined 85 per cent in the past 25 years while access to pornography has become freely available to teenagers and adults. The Nixon and Reagan Commissions tried to show that exposure to pornographic materials produced social violence. The reverse may be true: that pornography has reduced social violence.
    Well, nice premise, but this would appear to be a case of post hoc ergo proctor hoc.


    The study claims that since internet access has increased in the last 25 years and since pornography may be found on the internet porn has reduced rape…

    Uh huh…

    After the fact; therefore, because of the fact. Prof. might have easily noted that the number of online stock market trades has increased in the past 25 years whilst the number or rapes have decreased and thus concluded that increased investing decreases rape.

    Two lessons for researchers:

    1: Correlation does not equal causation
    2: Make sure your conclusions are marketable
    Mutz (E)

    Your Life Is Not My Fault

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    I am not trying to be contrary, but I might take that article with a grain of salt. I was unable to access anything more than the (very skimpy) abstract, so the only details are what was in that news article.

    I don't know the stats, but first off, correlation does not necessarily mean causality. I haven't seen the correlation stats either. It could be considered more compelling by showing (like he did) the individual examples of the extremes of Internet use and the comcomitant sexual assault stats.

    What really caused me to question this was I have always understood that rape is not merely a sexual act, that is, it is not due to an excess of libido. It is an act of control and domination. Guys don't rape simply because they are horny. Certainly, if one has no libido, rape is less likely (eg, chemical or physical castration), so maybe if one exhausts the libido with a flood of porn, that might have an effect.

    The numbers don't add up either. If rape, on average, is down 85%, how is it that the extreme of reduction (the high Net users) has a reduction of only 50%??

    Lastly, this is from a law school, not a sociology or psych department. Not saying that necessarily makes it wrong, but not really the expertise of lawyers.
    "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge" - Charles Darwin

    "One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision" - Bertrand Russell

  7. #7
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    This is pretty worthless, for the above mentioned reasons.
    Truth gains more even by the errors of one who, with due study and preparation, thinks for himself, than by the true opinions of those who only hold them because they do not suffer themselves to think.
    -John Stuart Mill

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shooterandproud View Post
    Very interesting. I wonder what some of our religious folk have to say about this.
    Suicide bombs up, Atom bombs down.
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    Here's a link that confirms that sexual assaults are down like 69% since 93.

    http://www.google.com/url?sa=L&ai=BT...KVpo_W-h0Ttks=

    So I guess the natural result of such news would be to lower the age that kids can access porn to oh, let's say 10 yrs old. That oughta keep them out of trouble huh ?

    Key Facts

    Every two and a half minutes, somewhere in America, someone is sexually assaulted.
    One in six American women are victims of sexual assault, and one in 33 men.
    In 2004-2005, there were an average annual 200,780 victims of rape, attempted rape or sexual assault.
    About 44% of rape victims are under age 18, and 80% are under age 30.
    Since 1993, rape/sexual assault has fallen by over 69%.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by thelmoose View Post
    I am not trying to be contrary, but I might take that article with a grain of salt. I was unable to access anything more than the (very skimpy) abstract, so the only details are what was in that news article.

    I don't know the stats, but first off, correlation does not necessarily mean causality. I haven't seen the correlation stats either. It could be considered more compelling by showing (like he did) the individual examples of the extremes of Internet use and the comcomitant sexual assault stats.

    What really caused me to question this was I have always understood that rape is not merely a sexual act, that is, it is not due to an excess of libido. It is an act of control and domination. Guys don't rape simply because they are horny. Certainly, if one has no libido, rape is less likely (eg, chemical or physical castration), so maybe if one exhausts the libido with a flood of porn, that might have an effect.

    The numbers don't add up either. If rape, on average, is down 85%, how is it that the extreme of reduction (the high Net users) has a reduction of only 50%??

    Lastly, this is from a law school, not a sociology or psych department. Not saying that necessarily makes it wrong, but not really the expertise of lawyers.
    You can find a more detailed explanation of Professor D'Amato's conclusions here:
    http://anthonydamato.law.northwester...files/porn.pdf
    Last edited by Galileo; 03-31-2007 at 06:13 AM.
    "Indeed, not a word in the constitutional text even arguably supports the Court’s overwrought and novel description of the Second Amendment as 'elevat[ing] above all other interests' 'the right of law-abiding, responsible citizens to use arms in defense of hearth and home.' Ante,at 63."
    -Justice Stevens on the Heller ruling

  11. #11
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    There's also evidence from other nations, especially Japan, that availability of porn is linked with a reduction in sex crimes.

    "Wilson (1978) found that 'Males who develop deviant patterns of sexual behavior in adulthood have suffered relative deprivation of experience with pornography in adolescence.' He suggests that pornography not only can, but does, help to prevent criminal sex problems (pp. 176)....It is certainly clear from the data reviewed, and the new data and analysis presented, that a massive increase in available pornography in Japan, the United States and elsewhere has been correlated with a dramatic decrease in sexual crimes and most so among youngsters as perpetrators or victims."

    And what happened in nations that had strict laws against porn? They experienced a big increase in the rape rate.
    "The countries of Singapore and Union of South Africa as well as the Australian State of Queensland, during the same period investigated by Kutchinsky (1964-1974), were firmly against any pornography. Their anti-obscenity laws were quite broad. In Singapore rape rates increased by 69 percent, in South Africa the rape rate increased by 28 percent and in Queensland the increase was 23 percent (Court, 1984)."
    http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/online_ar...phy_ovrvw.html
    "Indeed, not a word in the constitutional text even arguably supports the Court’s overwrought and novel description of the Second Amendment as 'elevat[ing] above all other interests' 'the right of law-abiding, responsible citizens to use arms in defense of hearth and home.' Ante,at 63."
    -Justice Stevens on the Heller ruling

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galileo View Post
    There's also evidence from other nations, especially Japan, that availability of porn is linked with a reduction in sex crimes.

    "Wilson (1978) found that 'Males who develop deviant patterns of sexual behavior in adulthood have suffered relative deprivation of experience with pornography in adolescence.' He suggests that pornography not only can, but does, help to prevent criminal sex problems (pp. 176)....It is certainly clear from the data reviewed, and the new data and analysis presented, that a massive increase in available pornography in Japan, the United States and elsewhere has been correlated with a dramatic decrease in sexual crimes and most so among youngsters as perpetrators or victims."

    And what happened in nations that had strict laws against porn? They experienced a big increase in the rape rate.
    "The countries of Singapore and Union of South Africa as well as the Australian State of Queensland, during the same period investigated by Kutchinsky (1964-1974), were firmly against any pornography. Their anti-obscenity laws were quite broad. In Singapore rape rates increased by 69 percent, in South Africa the rape rate increased by 28 percent and in Queensland the increase was 23 percent (Court, 1984)."
    http://www.hawaii.edu/PCSS/online_ar...phy_ovrvw.html
    Now this stuff interesting and shows some more persuasive evidence. Thanks for providing a link to the entire thing, but I still think that Amato paper is pretty flimsy. He posits a theory and then does very little to back it up other than some personal ideas. He should have done some regression analysis comparing sexual assault data to changes in Internet usage across all 50 states instead of arbitrarily picking the top and bottom 4.

    In any event, it is interesting research, the conclusion of that paper by Diamond is convincing:

    CONCLUSIONS
    The concern that countries allowing pornography and liberal anti-obscenity laws would show increased sex crime rates due to modeling or that children or adolescents in particular would be negatively vulnerable to and receptive to such models or that society would be otherwise adversely effected is not supported by evidence. It is certainly clear from the data reviewed, and the new data and analysis presented, that a massive increase in available pornography in Japan, the United States and elsewhere has been correlated with a dramatic decrease in sexual crimes and most so among youngsters as perpetrators or victims. Even in this area of concern no "clear and present danger" exists for the suppression of SEM. There is no evidence that pornography is intended or likely to produce "imminent lawless action" (see Brandenberg v. Ohio, 1969). It is reasonable that the U.S. Supreme Court has consistently rejected the principal that speech or expression can be punished because it offends some people's sensibilities or beliefs. Compared with "hate speech" or "commercial speech" there seems even less justification for banning "sex speech."21 22

    Sex abuse of any kind is deplorable and should be eliminated. Rape and sex crimes, like any criminal activities are blights on society which should be expunged. The question remains "How best to do this?" Most assuredly, focusing energy in the wrong direction, or taking actions just to placate victims, politicians or irate citizens will not solve the problem nor help. Nor will spreading myths or misinformation. Removing pornography from our midst will, according to the evidence, only hurt rather than help society.

    I think it is better to expend our energies in two directions. 1) Make better pornography so that preferred role models are portrayed and more segments of society can come to appreciate or at least understand and tolerate its value23; and 2) turn our research to other directions to eliminate or reduce the social ills of rape and other sex crimes. The best place to look is probably in the home during the first decade of life. But it is only by research that we can continue to understand how to most effectively meet this social challenge. Governments as well as the pornography industry itself would do well to finance and encourage such research.
    I agree that we should look to solutions that have some evidence of working rather than jumping to actions based on emotions.
    "Ignorance more frequently begets confidence than does knowledge" - Charles Darwin

    "One of the painful things about our time is that those who feel certainty are stupid, and those with any imagination and understanding are filled with doubt and indecision" - Bertrand Russell

  13. #13
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    A youtube video about the inverse relationship between porn and rape:

    YouTube - Porn Up, Rape Down!
    "Indeed, not a word in the constitutional text even arguably supports the Court’s overwrought and novel description of the Second Amendment as 'elevat[ing] above all other interests' 'the right of law-abiding, responsible citizens to use arms in defense of hearth and home.' Ante,at 63."
    -Justice Stevens on the Heller ruling

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    Can child porn serve as a substitute for sex crimes against children? Sexual abuse of children has decreased while access to child porn has increased:

    "Could making child pornography legal lead to lower rates of child sex abuse? It could well do, according to a new study by Milton Diamond, from the University of Hawaii, and colleagues.

    "Results from the Czech Republic showed, as seen everywhere else studied (Canada, Croatia, Denmark, Germany, Finland, Hong Kong, Shanghai, Sweden, USA), that rape and other sex crimes have not increased following the legalization and wide availability of pornography. And most significantly, the incidence of child sex abuse has fallen considerably since 1989, when child pornography became readily accessible – a phenomenon also seen in Denmark and Japan. Their findings are published online today in Springer's journal Archives of Sexual Behavior...."
    Legalizing child pornography is linked to lower rates of child sex abuse | Science Codex
    "Indeed, not a word in the constitutional text even arguably supports the Court’s overwrought and novel description of the Second Amendment as 'elevat[ing] above all other interests' 'the right of law-abiding, responsible citizens to use arms in defense of hearth and home.' Ante,at 63."
    -Justice Stevens on the Heller ruling

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    Key word: outlet. Been saying it's a bright idea for a while.

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