Poll: Can ex-gays really become hetersexual?

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Thread: Ex-gays or not

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by jitobear
    Jim and Evan -

    I am just not gonna take the word of a couple of straight dudes about what it is or is not to be gay - or how and why one happens to be gay.

    (They aren't into chicks like me so SOMETHING must have gone wrong.... )

    Bambino is good. Baseball season now.
    I don't think there's a descriptor that can be applied to every gay person as to why they are gay. I have seen and known effeminate men who likely can't help being gay. I have known a burly straight looking gay man who says he is gay because he was seduced in junior high school and he liked it. I believe each gay person has a reason for being gay. Some are by choice, some are by genetics...but this globally applied argument that "we can't help it" it BS in a brown bag.
    What you say can and will be used against you.
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  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by jim's trucking
    I don't think there's a descriptor that can be applied to every gay person as to why they are gay. I have seen and known effeminate men who likely can't help being gay. I have known a burly straight looking gay man who says he is gay because he was seduced in junior high school and he liked it. I believe each gay person has a reason for being gay. Some are by choice, some are by genetics...but this globally applied argument that "we can't help it" it BS in a brown bag.
    And I know a gay man who tried it with a woman and promptly vomited on her.

    And maybe you should try dating guys for a month, or women you don't find attractive even - before stating their claims B.S.
    “But who prays for Satan? Who, in eighteen centuries, has had the common humanity to pray for the one sinner that needed it most? ” ~ Mark Twain

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  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by jitobear
    And I know a gay man who tried it with a woman and promptly vomited on her.
    Could have been the odor...or nervousness.

    And maybe you should try dating guys for a month, or women you don't find attractive even - before stating their claims B.S.
    I do not doubt that two straight men could arouse and satisfy each other physically. The physical response to physical stimulation is likely involuntary to a great extent.

    If one defines dating as planning and participating in a mutual experience, I've already dated straight men. I used to go hunting/fishing with one straight guy, I used to play tennis with another, I go to a strip club often with another, and to car races with yet another, I have dinner often with another man...but none of us ever got turned on to each other.

    If one defines dating as "trying to get some", then I doubt I will ever date a man, straight or gay.

    I stated that the claim that all gays were born gay is BS, not that none were born gay.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dzeron
    Why else would they be called "ex-" gays?
    Rather interesting how they label themselves as "ex"-gays, eh...

    I mean, if a guy converted from Baptist to Lutheran, he wouldn't call himself an "ex-Baptist". He'ld call himself a Lutheran.

    But "ex-gays" refer to themselves as "ex-gays", whereas it would make more sense to refer to themselves as "straight" or some other synonym.


    Or perhaps it's a move similar to "alcoholics", who label themselves as "alcoholics" even if they've been sober for years. The analogy being that "ex-gays" still have attraction towards people of the same gender, thus not being truly "straight" in their sexual attractions...
    "Senator, when you took your oath of office, you placed your hand on the Bible and swore to uphold the Constitution.
    You did not place your hand on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible."
    *** Jamie Raskin

  5. #35
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    If we're going to talk about changing gay people to straight people, maybe we should examine the MEANS by which they attempt it...

    Does any of this sound like it would work?

    People don't seem to realize that a LOT of these "reparative therapy" groups have little to no professional psychiatric training. Many of these organizations have no accreditation, and operate under thoroughly rejected psychiatric assumptions.

    "Love in Action is not licensed by the Tennessee Departments of Health, Mental Health, Human Services, Child Services or Education, according to Rachel Lassiter of Gov. Phil Bredesen’s communications office.
    ....
    He (Peterson Toscano) said that the program, which cost $950 per month, was highly restrictive. While he was in the program he was forbidden to go to most parts of Memphis, could not touch other men and had to submit to lengthy meetings where participants criticized each other over the ways that they appeared to be gay. Clients at Love in Action had to describe their sexual fantasies and deviant behaviors in front of groups so that they would be shamed, Toscano said."
    http://www.washblade.com/2005/6-24/n.../tennprobe.cfm

    Other whacky ideas they utilize?

    "On Paula Zahn’s CNN show tonight, Richard Cohen demonstrates key aspects of the reparative therapy he practices.

    He sits upright on a sofa, his client sprawls lengthwise for a close chest-to-chest embrace. The reporter does a sanity-check, asking the client if he feels aroused. Nope, just safe.

    Cohen, saying that another key technique is designed to release memories embedded deeply in one’s muscles, raises a tennis racquet above his head and bashes a pillow once for each word he screams at his mother."
    http://atb.opho.org/atb/


    "Defeat Will Make Some Straight Men Crave Gay Sex
    “Non-homosexual men who experience defeat and failure may also experience homosexual fantasies or dreams.” (Dr. Joseph Nicolosi, National Association of Research and Therapy of Homosexuality)

    The Rubber Band Technique
    “Every time you catch yourself watching someone erotically or engaging in fantasy, snap the band. This will cause a moderate stinging pain, which serves as a shocking reminder of what you are doing. This should help you interrupt the spell.” (Bill Consiglio, Author, "Homosexual No More")

    Playing Sports Will Make You Hetero
    "I recently counseled a fifty-year old man who carried a heavy burden since he was twelve. He thought that he had no eye-hand coordination, could not throw a ball, and therefore was less than the other boys and less than a man. I paired him up with a friend of mine who was willing to play ball with him. Within a few days, a new man was born. He could throw a ball. He just needed some practice and a sympathetic man to show him the ropes." (Richard Cohen, President, Parents and Friends of Ex-Gays)

    Prozac Can Cure Homosexuality
    “When we consider that there is no objective distinction between homosexuality and the other perversions, we can easily see how the development of the homosexual ‘habit’ fits into this framework (of cures through medication). Some [homosexuals]…are being successfully treated with Prozac. Here too, sexual reorientation is reported to have occurred incidentally.” (Dr. Jeffrey Satinover , M.D., Author)

    Prayer and Faith Cures AIDS
    “Today, with God’s abundant grace, and His miraculous power to heal, I walk totally free from the AIDS virus.” (Michael Lumberger, Exodus)

    "Matthew was delivered from homosexuality in 1989 and miraculously healed from HIV/AIDS in 1994." (Mathew C. Manning's web-site http://www.matthewcmanning.com/)

    ** Note: Exodus Executive Director Alan Chamber's also believes that AIDS can be cured through prayer. When asked about Manning's supposed healing he told me, "God is bigger than science.

    Trouble in Mom's Womb Can Make You Gay
    “If a mother was experiencing difficulty in her relationship with her husband while carrying a child or if she felt rejected, unloved or unwanted by him or she experienced any other painful experiences during pregnancy, the unborn child within may have experienced these thoughts and feelings as though they were directed at him or her.” (Richard Cohen, President, Parents and Friends of Ex-Gays)

    Hypnosis Can Make You Hetero
    “At the count of three, your subconscious mind will make you aware of the cause of your homosexual behavior…You need to form in your mind the event you have been looking for whether it was created in this or a previous lifetime…Your soul records are available to you on this issue. You learn from the past and move on!”(Potentials Unlimited, “Gay and Unhappy”, A Self-Hypnotic Tape)

    Focusing on a Tree Will Help Make You Hetero
    “I would start to experience a sexual response… So I would look out my car window and say something like, ‘Gosh, Lord, there’s a tree out there! That tree is green, and has leaves on it. It’s got brown bark.’ I would fix my mind on anything to distract myself…Over time, that made me mentally disciplined enough to displace all lesbian thoughts, period.”(Anne Paulk, Co-Author, "Love Won Out")

    Many of the Best Christians Are Mentally Ill
    “Many of these persons – having suffered breakdowns and hospitalizations in the past – end up being the strongest and most effective Christians because, having been under such bondage to the voices of the past and present, they gladly listen for the life-giving Word in order to survive as persons.” (LeAnne Payne, Author, "The Broken Image")

    Gaining Weight Will Help Make You Hetero
    “My weight started to increase, and I found little desire to keep on a strict diet and stay fashionably slim. My very appearance was changing. I was looking less and less gay. And I was perfectly happy about it.”(John Paulk, Spokesperson, Focus on the Family) "
    http://www.anythingbutstraight.com/learn/egideas.html
    "Senator, when you took your oath of office, you placed your hand on the Bible and swore to uphold the Constitution.
    You did not place your hand on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible."
    *** Jamie Raskin

  6. #36
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    Let's get something "straight" here. (pun intended)

    I was married to a man, had a child with that man.

    Does that mean I was straight? Or does that mean I was "Acting/living" straight?

    I later became involved with a woman.

    Does that make me bi-sexual, lesbian or straight acting/living lesbian?

    Only I can answer that.

    Only with my knowledge of my sexual attractions, my socially repressed sexual desires and my knowledge of the life I would rather live and be happy knowing I'm being honest with myself and my son.


    As far as "ex-gays" there's not ONE piece of peer reviewed and accredited evidence any gay person has ever been "cured" of their homosexuality. Not one.
    Not one of these groups has ever been endorsed by the AMA, AAP or APA.
    NOT ONE!
    They're dangerous to all people, gays and straights alike. They fill heads with lies based in religious undertones that say being gay is sinful.
    They cannot provide one piece of evidence that being gay is harmful in any way, shape or form to humans.
    All too often these supposedly "cured" gays eventually return to living as gays because that's just who they are!

    Get over it, deal with it, accept it. It's fact, it's been proved time and time again.
    When will you people just learn to accept reality and stop trying to manipulate others to become what you can feel comfortable with?

    I'm completely comfortable and extremely grateful for the diversity of human beings.
    Without it we'd all be colorless, culture-less and dumb.
    Celebrate Diversity!
    Morality is doing what's right no matter what you are told.

    Religion is doing what you are told no matter what's right.

    If you're not part of the solution;
    You ARE the problem!

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by JustineCredible
    Not one of these groups has ever been endorsed by the AMA, AAP or APA.
    NOT ONE!
    A lot of these groups operate with NO accreditation, and NO medical or scientific degree is required (or present) for the "counselors" who work there.

    You wouldn't go to a hospital where the "doctors" had no degrees, but that's exactly how a lot of these "ex-gay" places operate...


    Quote Originally Posted by JustineCredible
    They're dangerous to all people, gays and straights alike. They fill heads with lies based in religious undertones that say being gay is sinful.
    In June 2005, a 16-year-old Tennessee male, Zach (last name omitted for privacy reasons), posted a blog entry on his MySpace site...

    The program Zach noted is a Love In Action-run camp known as Refuge. The subsequent protests drew both extensive local media attention and international interest, with individuals from Europe, America and elsewhere getting involved. Particular attention was given to a quote attributed to the man running the program, John Smid:

    "I would rather you commit suicide than have you leave Love In Action wanting to return to the gay lifestyle. In a physical death you could still have a spiritual resurrection; whereas, returning to homosexuality you are yielding yourself to a spiritual death from which there is no recovery."
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ex-gay
    "Senator, when you took your oath of office, you placed your hand on the Bible and swore to uphold the Constitution.
    You did not place your hand on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible."
    *** Jamie Raskin

  8. #38
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    Dear Abby...

    DEAR ABBY: I have reason to believe that a young man in my family may be gay. (He is 15.) I have been thinking a lot about it lately, and have been wondering if circumcision would cure it. What do you think? -- Grandmother in Missouri

    Dear Missouri Grandmother: Homosexuality is not an illness, and therefore there is no need for a "cure." I predict that your family will be happier if you accept your relative exactly the way he is, love him, support him and stop trying to think of ways to cure him.
    http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/...cctimes_living
    "Senator, when you took your oath of office, you placed your hand on the Bible and swore to uphold the Constitution.
    You did not place your hand on the Constitution and swear to uphold the Bible."
    *** Jamie Raskin

  9. #39
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    Ex-Gay...Yeah right!

    I'd just like to comment on the statement made that some str8 guy on here said he knew a burly masculine guy that was gay. That burly man told him he was seduced into being gay in high school and liked it, that's what turned him gay. Oh yeah, you have to work hard to seduce a teenage boy to have sex! What a crock he was handing you. You are either gay or you're not. You don't turn gay from one experience. Think about it. Could some guy actually seduce you if you are a str8 man? Of course not! Str8 men have no attraction to their same sex. Every single gay person I know had the same exact experiences when they were very young and had no idea what sex even was (I honestly did not know until my friends told me when I was 13...I got mad and said my parents would never do that!!! How disgusting!). Ah, to be a kid again! All of the gay guys I know knew they were different from the other boys at a VERY young age...not a sexual difference, but just something different that we couldn't put our finger on.

    Here's something I've noticed when it comes to a difference between Bi men and gay men. Bi men DON'T like to kiss another man (sorry for TMI, but I just gotta share!). Only gay men like to kiss other men. So I think the gay part of Bi is just a kinky fetish for them. I honestly don't think Bi's are capable of loving another man, but they can have limited sex with them. So being an Ex-Gay would be an easy thing, no struggle at all. They are still attracted to women and can have relations and even marry the person they love.

    Now, I've heard an argument about the 'socialized to be gay' theory. When questioning/possibly gay kids are young, they are usually picked on and outcast by the other boys. So the theory is they long for close relationships with their same sex and they end up confusing intimacy with friendship. The problem with that theory is the kid is already noticed for being different...so there was already something there that caused the other kids to pick on him and outcast him. So that theory just doesn't make sense (to me).

    On the light side, I've heard a saying......you are not recruited into the gay lifestyle....you're sucked into it!

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimStPete View Post
    Here's something I've noticed when it comes to a difference between Bi men and gay men. Bi men DON'T like to kiss another man (sorry for TMI, but I just gotta share!). Only gay men like to kiss other men. So I think the gay part of Bi is just a kinky fetish for them. I honestly don't think Bi's are capable of loving another man, but they can have limited sex with them. So being an Ex-Gay would be an easy thing, no struggle at all. They are still attracted to women and can have relations and even marry the person they love.
    Huh. That's really interesting. I know that for me kissing is as much of a sexual act as sex is. So I (as a bi female) get as much sexual pleasure out of kissing women as I do men. But I don't honestly see myself ever falling in love with a woman either. I'm not saying it's impossible, I've just never had those sorts of feelings for another woman before. But then I'm also a woman, so possibly it's different for women?

    My SO is bi also, but he's had extremely limited same-sex experience, mostly I suppose because he's had an extremely limited number of sexual relationships period. I believe for him it's also just sexual, and not a love sort of thing, but I have no idea if he likes the idea of kissing other men, or if he's only interested in the below-the-belt stuff. I should ask him!

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by JimStPete View Post
    Now, I've heard an argument about the 'socialized to be gay' theory. When questioning/possibly gay kids are young, they are usually picked on and outcast by the other boys. So the theory is they long for close relationships with their same sex and they end up confusing intimacy with friendship. The problem with that theory is the kid is already noticed for being different...so there was already something there that caused the other kids to pick on him and outcast him. So that theory just doesn't make sense (to me).

    On the light side, I've heard a saying......you are not recruited into the gay lifestyle....you're sucked into it!

    I'd like to address the "socialized into" idea here. This socialization theory also extends to the argument as to why gays/lesbians supposedly shouldn't be parents. There's a part of that theory that makes the argument that a child being raised by two members of the same sex would grow up to be gay.
    I'd like to point out the extreme unlikelihood of this. As only about 1 - 10% of all children raised by same sex partners turn out to be gay as adults. Interesting since it's the EXACT same percentage of children raised by OPPOSITE sex couples who turn out to be gay adults! WOW, fancy that?!
    Most gay/lesbian adults were raised by OPPOSITE sex couples. Who knew?

    My ex husband actually protested that he didn't want me to move in with a gay male friend when we divorced because he was certain that merely living with a gay man in the home would turn his son gay!
    Later he tried to convince my son that because "Mommy lives with another woman" that this would turn him gay as well.

    Sad to say, that with as hard as I obviously tried, my son is irreversibly straight. Darn...guess I just didn't raise him right.
    Morality is doing what's right no matter what you are told.

    Religion is doing what you are told no matter what's right.

    If you're not part of the solution;
    You ARE the problem!

  12. #42
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    ex-gay? never met anyone claiming that.
    "many illegals come here for the right reasons and help our economy but the majority are like pirates and see America as just another port to pillage and plunder" -J.P. Donoghue

  13. #43
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    There are some, esp. within religious reform groups...

  14. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUNxTime View Post
    There are some, esp. within religious reform groups...
    how about half gay...half straight or three quarters gay...one quarter straight

    http://www.spinner.com/2007/06/08/20...-moments-no-9/
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  15. #45
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    LOL, there probably are some people who claim that... I was just answering Iron, about 'ex-gay' I think they call themselves 'reformed homosexuals' or 'reborn' etc... Maybe with fertility treatments some people will be born, half gay, 1/16 native American, 1/8 lesbian, etc...

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