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Thread: Is there REALLY such a thing as ADD/ADHD...?

  1. #1
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    Is there REALLY such a thing as ADD/ADHD...?

    I mean think about it. It's pretty clear that parents of today are definitely more lazy and less involved with their kids than parents of the past. Disciplining kids is hard work and takes a great deal of energy and consistency. I firmly believe that many kids diagnosed as having ADD/ADHD (or whatever the hell it is) are simply the product of lazy parents. While I don't have a sampling sufficient enough to classify as a scientific study, I can site my wife's experiences as a pre-school teacher. She is very strict and has had several kids who have been been diagnosed with this "condition" and has gotten them under control (without their medication). She evn had one lady who was CONSIDERING taking her child in to be diagnosed and to get the medication and my wife told her that she has him under control in the classroom. The mother said at home he's out of control (I thought this was a condition that couldn't be controlled without medication...go figure) and even with this input provided by my wife, the mother still chose to go for the medication...lazy XXX parent. No doubt I've ****** some folks off here, but I'd sure love to hear the opinions anyway...have at it

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    I think there is certainly such thing as ADD. I don't think it is nearly as common as some would have you believe. I believe there is such thing as depression. I don't think it is nearly as common as people seem to think (especially health care/mental health professionals in both cases) seem to believe.

    You look at the number of cases of ADD/ADHD in this country, and they have been incresing fairly consistently fo a long time. I have trouble believeing that we are just breeding ADD prone children.

    To me this is a case of misuse of the prescription pad by doctors. Granted they can prescribe ritalin and the childs perfomance is likely to improve in school. If YOU started taking ritalin, there is a good chance that your performance would improve at work. Cocain would do the same thing for you. It allows hyperattentiveness. Many stimulants do this (ephederine, crystal meth, all sorts of stuff).

    I think that before we decide that every kid on the planet who fails to perform at school needs to be on ADD medication (usually ritalin) we need to ask some pretty serious questions regarding the negative side effects of the drug and how badly it is shredding their little brains.

    When I was 18 I got a call one night form a friend of my sisters. My sister, who had been taking prescription antidepressants, had run out 3 days before. She was trying to claw out her eyes and kill herself.

    the next monday the psychiatrist who had been feeding her things for years told me that "it is not at all uncommon for young girls who have been taking anti depressants for years to become suicidally depressed if they are taken off of them". If there had not been 6 other people in the room, I would have smashed that SOB's head against the corner of his desk until there was nothing left but mush.

    I started looking into it, and found that giving anti depressants to teenage girls like they are pez is a pretty common practice anymore. Have a bad day? Having a rough time with your teenage years ( I think the teenage years areespecially hard on girls and they tend to go a little nutty sometimes. Boys don't go nuts until their early 20's)? Well, we have some little red pills that will make it all better.

    I can certainly envision Ritalin becoming for boys (who are most often diagnosed with ADD/ADHD) what those antidepressants are for teenage girls; prescribed chemical dependance with long term negative effects.

    My solution would be to take baout 2/3 of the "mental health" professionals out there and make them get real jobs. The remainder can be barred from treating anybodyt who is not seriously mentally ill (schizo, psychotic, whatever). The rest of us can get by without paying somebody $100 per hour to tell us that "it is not your fault".

    Make a friend, find a good bartender, get married, whatever. Just stay out of the shrinks office. I think those folks destroy more lives than any other profession out there.

    As an interesting side note, the same sister, who is to this day heavily medicated, has grown up to be a psychiatrist. You would think that somebody who can't make it through the day themselves without a large assortment of mood altering substances would be a ratehr poor choice to help others with their emotional "problems", most of which could likely be solved if they could find somebody to smack them on the back of the head and tell them to "get your **** together. Call off the XXXXXXn pity parade and quite your whining". My father was always good at this. I am sure that he would be happy to volunteer to do this for folks on saturday morning (on sundays he could smack them on the back of the head and give his famous "you'd better straighten up and fly right or you will find my footprint on your XXX" speech to those who think they have ADD).
    If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. —Samuel Adams

  3. #3
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    I think it does exist. I got a friend who had medical tests run on his brain chemistry that came out real abnormal. After he takes his meds he's pretty normal (well normal for him), if he doesn't take his meds there's no way I'm getting into a car with him driving, i'd rather drive with a drunkard.
    Some people love their country because of what it is, because of the principles it is built on, because of its prosperity and freedom. Then others love their country because it is their country, and will destroy all that is actually good about it to silence those who disagree. Which do you think you are? - Symbiote

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    The long and short of it is yes, The brain chemistry in kids and adult with ADHD or ADD is that there brain is going too fast. It isn't producing enough of the chemicals it need to slow down and pat attention to things. Addreral and Ritilin and similar drugs speed the brain up more forcing it to make more of the chemicals it need to slow itself down. Sort of the idea of a car engine that has been flooded running slower.

    My partner has ADHD and if he doesn't take his adderal He makes me crazy because he is like a little kid bouncing around the house doing 20 things at once and not finishing anything before going onto something else. It is the idea that the brain isn't making the chemicals, so medicine forces it.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by joebrummer
    The long and short of it is yes, The brain chemistry in kids and adult with ADHD or ADD is that there brain is going too fast. It isn't producing enough of the chemicals it need to slow down and pat attention to things. Addreral and Ritilin and similar drugs speed the brain up more forcing it to make more of the chemicals it need to slow itself down. Sort of the idea of a car engine that has been flooded running slower.

    My partner has ADHD and if he doesn't take his adderal He makes me crazy because he is like a little kid bouncing around the house doing 20 things at once and not finishing anything before going onto something else. It is the idea that the brain isn't making the chemicals, so medicine forces it.

    Do you think there are possible negative side effects to giving these drugs to misdiagnosed kids?

    I have a nephew who was just "diagnosed" with ADD by his doctor. His mother filled out a single page questionaire and that was all there was to it.
    If ye love wealth greater than liberty, the tranquility of servitude greater than the animating contest for freedom, go home from us in peace. We seek not your counsel, nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you; May your chains set lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that ye were our countrymen. —Samuel Adams

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    When my oldest was about 4 years old, they told me he had ADD and put him on Ritalin... He was a very active little boy...
    After a week, I took him off because he had made him into a zombie. He has since been fine. I think there are a lot of parents looking for an excuse, and it took the burden off of them. I have no doubt there are children who do in fact need help but I also believe there is a lot of hog wash out there too.
    I also believe that this is not something you can diagnose in one visit. The doctor who saw my son, was with him for about 5 minutes... How many 4 year olds are active? ALL of them... 5 minutes is not enough time to come to any conclusion.
    "The man who alters his way of thinking to suit others is a fool."
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    Yes, there is a real medical condition called ADD/ADHD, and the symptoms are real. But I`m very sceptic to medication as the sole treatment of these disorders. I`m also fairly sceptic towards diagnosing children without serious cause. The effects of diagnosing a child is that it is labeled and marked as deviant. For some, this may come as a relief. For others, it may become a self-fulfilling prophesy...
    Knowledge is power. Hide it well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Anastasia
    When my oldest was about 4 years old, they told me he had ADD and put him on Ritalin... He was a very active little boy...
    After a week, I took him off because he had made him into a zombie. He has since been fine. I think there are a lot of parents looking for an excuse, and it took the burden off of them. I have no doubt there are children who do in fact need help but I also believe there is a lot of hog wash out there too.
    I also believe that this is not something you can diagnose in one visit. The doctor who saw my son, was with him for about 5 minutes... How many 4 year olds are active? ALL of them... 5 minutes is not enough time to come to any conclusion.
    This is the very same thing my wife and I went through with our youngest (my stepson). And handled it the same way.
    I just noticed one day that he was real active like another kid I knew when I was much younger. Realizing this and knowing what "cured" him, I "slowed the world down", so to speak, for our boy. The "cure" was giving him a little more responsibilty and increasing his chores. "Slowing the world down" consisted of spending much more quality time with him...the best medicine I know of...and allowing him to adjust in his own fashion.

    That was 2 years ago. Now he's drug-free and doing great.

    I do think that ADD exists, but not like the teachers and doctors want it to.
    Ain't life funny...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie
    Yes, there is a real medical condition called ADD/ADHD, and the symptoms are real. But I`m very sceptic to medication as the sole treatment of these disorders. I`m also fairly sceptic towards diagnosing children without serious cause. The effects of diagnosing a child is that it is labeled and marked as deviant. For some, this may come as a relief. For others, it may become a self-fulfilling prophesy...
    I think there are people with different brain chemistries and it happens to make them more active if not hyperactive. Is this a disorder/disease? Does it need medical treatment? Probably not, especially in the case of "ADD kids."

    Like Big Orn said, in most cases it could probably be handled more effectlively by some lifestyle changes or a change in habits.
    You don't go changing horsemen in the middle of the apocalypse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pnac=ww3
    I think there are people with different brain chemistries and it happens to make them more active if not hyperactive. Is this a disorder/disease?
    It`s a disorder, yes. I`m not sure I would call it a disease though.

    Quote Originally Posted by pnac=ww3
    Does it need medical treatment? Probably not, especially in the case of "ADD kids."
    I agree. As I said before, I`m not a great fan of medication in these regards.


    Quote Originally Posted by pnac=ww3
    Like Big Orn said, in most cases it could probably be handled more effectlively by some lifestyle changes or a change in habits.
    Perhaps. But I would also like to point out that we sometimes should get away from the notion of "curing" or handling the disorder. Why should the child be adapted to suit or (sometimes pointless) norms and systems. Why not try to adapt the school to suit every child? I know its a fantasy, but I`m fairly convident that we could get pretty far by simply realising that behavioural disorders are merely disorders because that particular behaviour is viewed as deviant or obstructive in certain situations.
    Knowledge is power. Hide it well.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by daewoo
    Do you think there are possible negative side effects to giving these drugs to misdiagnosed kids?

    I have a nephew who was just "diagnosed" with ADD by his doctor. His mother filled out a single page questionaire and that was all there was to it.


    If children are given the medicine and are not really ADHD or ADD. The medicine won't work. It will have the opposite effect. You will have a speeding kid on you hands. Most of these drugs are classified as anphedimines.


    Edited to add: There are very clear signs and symptoms. It goes further than a lack of attention. Surpriseingly easy to diagnose.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie
    It`s a disorder, yes. I`m not sure I would call it a disease though.
    What's the difference?
    Is herpes a disease or a disorder? What about hemorhoids? What about acne?
    What about schizophrenia?


    Perhaps. But I would also like to point out that we sometimes should get away from the notion of "curing" or handling the disorder. Why should the child be adapted to suit or (sometimes pointless) norms and systems. Why not try to adapt the school to suit every child? I know its a fantasy, but I`m fairly convident that we could get pretty far by simply realising that behavioural disorders are merely disorders because that particular behaviour is viewed as deviant or obstructive in certain situations.
    I don't know about fitting a school around a child, but I agree with you here in that we shouldn't go around trying to hammer everyone into conformity.
    You don't go changing horsemen in the middle of the apocalypse.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by pnac=ww3
    What's the difference?
    Is herpes a disease or a disorder? What about hemorhoids? What about acne?
    What about schizophrenia?

    Diseases are physiological, disorders are psychological. Schizophrenia is a disease because it has a neurological base. PTSD is a disorder because it has a psycgological base.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie
    Perhaps. But I would also like to point out that we sometimes should get away from the notion of "curing" or handling the disorder. Why should the child be adapted to suit or (sometimes pointless) norms and systems. Why not try to adapt the school to suit every child? I know its a fantasy, but I`m fairly convident that we could get pretty far by simply realising that behavioural disorders are merely disorders because that particular behaviour is viewed as deviant or obstructive in certain situations.
    Imbalance is imbalance - whether it's in the brain due to chemicals or from the lack of simple discipline. It is very hard to diagnose the difference when a child has no clue why they are acting different, or in a way that cannot promote their ability to fit into society, or that a certain behavior is required.
    Like Pnac said, we should not “hammer” our children to fit into a society, but we can’t allow abnormal behavior to go unchecked, either. It is required that parents be aware of their area’s lifestyle, which in the USA doesn’t differ that much from coast to coast, and are able to situate a child so that he or she can easily adjust as they mature. When we see that a child is not adjusting, then we have to step in and influence their behavior. It’s a touchy subject and one that most parents are reluctant to discuss outside the bubble of parenthood.

    Getting any institution to change for the good of just one maladjusted child is a fantasy, Eddie, but a noble one…coming from a loving parent.
    Ain't life funny...

  15. #15
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    I think some of you may not understand what ADHD and ADD are about. Yes alot of kids are told they have it who don't. It is also sometimes confused with bi-polar disoder in children because of the similarities in symptoms. This link may help a bit...


    http://www.mentalhealth.com/dis1/p21-ch01.html
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