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Thread: [B]Social Security ain’t a Ponzi scheme.[/B]

  1. #1
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    [B]Social Security ain’t a Ponzi scheme.[/B]

    Social Security ain’t a Ponzi scheme.

    Lesser income earners have lesser discretionary incomes. Were it not for federal SS retirement’s mandated characteristics of shared employees and employers contributions, those earning less than upper middle incomes would generally not otherwise accumulate sufficient funding to provide for their own retirement or their survivors’ needs.

    Prior to the enactment of SS, these were the usual circumstances for most people and expected life spans were much shorter. Many higher income earners never seriously conceive the possibility of their families’ future need for SS retirement benefits but such financial reversals were and continue not to be rare or uncommon.

    [SS Retirement is somewhat similar to a whole life insurance contract that becomes lifetime annuities upon the insured persons reaching their retirement ages. Upon the death of the insured and under some additional restrictions the plans become annuities for the insured persons’ surviving spouses and children. SS's purpose is to help provide for insured persons’ existence when retired and (within some regulation qualification) the existence of their surviving spouses and children. Unlike deferred income tax accounts, its pupose is not to additionally increase the estates of deceased persons.

    No commercial institution has lesser ratio between the distributed payments to participants and the total annuity plus insurance revenues. SS retirement system is a non-profit plan with minimal rate of overhead expenditures. There are two demographic problems with the SS retirement system. Problems due to inconsistent rates of population growth are temporary and correct themselves.
    Life spans’ increase due to medical advances is much more problematic to SS’s finances. Unfortunately the quality of peoples’ ability to continue earning incomes have not kept pace with those increased life spans.

    Increasing retirement ages will result in increased poverty among the elderly and additional public assistance expenditures. Unless and until we’re able to improve our national health, I advocate modifying our funding methods to increase SS retirements’ revenues.]


    Some advocate persons be able to opt for non-participation in the SS Retirement system or individual retirement accounts and persons’ rights to select investments that may possibly increase the values of their accounts.

    The arguments against individual retirement accounts.

    Currently unspent SS revenues are invested only in federally issued securities.
    Regardless of an individual’s desires for total self determination, aggregate lack of sufficient funding during their retirement annuities’ accumulation phases may be insufficient. This will not be unusual among lower income and lesser middle income earners.

    Additionally during normally encountered down turns of business cycles, an entire generation reaching their retirement ages would generally suffer insufficient accumulated funding for their individual retirement annuities; that would additionally be to their families’ financial and our national economic detriments.

    Respectfully, Supposn

  2. #2
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    Smile

    It seems to me that Social Security is having solvency problems because our government is spending too much money on the military, on warehousing too many people in prison for using drugs, and of course many large corporations and filthy rich people don't pay taxes, or certainly don't pay their fair share. That is why Social Security is in a crisis.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by WolfLarsen View Post
    It seems to me that Social Security is having solvency problems because our government is spending too much money on the military, on warehousing too many people in prison for using drugs, and of course many large corporations and filthy rich people don't pay taxes, or certainly don't pay their fair share. That is why Social Security is in a crisis.
    Not true. Social Security is in the red because the Government cut the Payroll Tax from 6% to 4%. With the increased unemployment there is less money going into the Trust than is being paid each month, so the Government has to borrow to pay the difference . Social Security is Off Budget and doesn't count towards the National Debt or the Deficits. It will remain in a crisis until they increase the Payroll Taxes back to 6% for Employees . But there's still well over 2 trillion in the trust fund so It's solvent for a few years yet.
    "You're too stupid to be saved." -- EasyRider.


    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
    Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
    Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
    Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
    Epicurus

  4. #4
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    Nice numbers. However, with our government spending endless amounts of money on exotic weapons of mass destruction, fighting two wars at the same time (now one), endless tax breaks for the rich the fact is our government is headed towards BANKRUPTCY.

    If capitalism cannot provide workers with a decent standard of living after they have worked and paid taxes for nearly 50 years than the time has come to end capitalism.

    You talk about unemployed workers, and the fact that they are not paying into the system. Unemployment is always present under capitalism. That's one more reason to get rid of capitalism. If everyone has the right to a job and everyone is working then there is plenty of taxes coming in. The question is: what do we do with those taxes?

    The workers are the ones paying the taxes. The worker should get good pensions, free quality medical care, free quality childcare, etc.

    The rich need to go get a job and be self-sufficient.
    Choosing between the Democrats and the Republicans is like choosing between AIDS and cancer.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xcaliber View Post
    Not true. Social Security is in the red because the Government cut the Payroll Tax from 6% to 4%. With the increased unemployment there is less money going into the Trust than is being paid each month, so the Government has to borrow to pay the difference . Social Security is Off Budget and doesn't count towards the National Debt or the Deficits. It will remain in a crisis until they increase the Payroll Taxes back to 6% for Employees . But there's still well over 2 trillion in the trust fund so It's solvent for a few years yet.
    Social security is not in the red. It's no where near the red for at least two decades.

    Reagan used the SS trust fund to make his budgets look and to hide his deficits. Nevertheless, SS needs some minimal tweaking to keep it going for longer than present inducations.
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    Reagan used the SS trust fund to make his budgets look and to hide his deficits. Nevertheless, SS needs some minimal tweaking to keep it going for longer than present inducations.
    Tsk tsk...

    Enough of your liberal revisionism.

    Presidents can't raid any fund. At that time the fund was under the control of the Democratic party, who controlled the House and the purse strings.
    “For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries.” - Robert Jastrow

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    SS needs some minimal tweaking to keep it going for longer than present inducations.
    and after that some more minor tweaking?

    It's just a bad program in general. Social Security is forced to invest in Treasury bills which means we automatically create debt by running this program.

    Maybe it's time to turn SS back to what it initially was, a welfare program.

  8. #8
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    Social Security is not in a threatened position relative to those baby boomers who have paind into it. When we add up the cost of living against hte newer generation of workers; who make much less statistically, there is then a projection ( crystal ball ) that social security will not be able to pay its way, and those who invest in it from here on will come up short. This is the same type of case that conservative shills try to make with respect to union pension funds.

    The only thing wrong with the American social security system is that it's under attack by those who want to control the funds: the speculators.
    He Lived in the Perfect Midfield Time

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    Social security is not in the red. It's no where near the red for at least two decades.

    Reagan used the SS trust fund to make his budgets look and to hide his deficits. Nevertheless, SS needs some minimal tweaking to keep it going for longer than present inducations.
    Not true, Social Security is currently running in the red. Benefits are paid out each month with what revenue comes in each month.. under today's current policy there is not enough coming in to cover the monthly expenses therefore they are now draining the trust fund of the surplus...

    Yes Reagan used the trust, As did Bush 1 and Clinton, .. It's the Law. The Money left over after payments are made for the month doesn't go into the trust as cash, the Government is FORCED by the Social Security Law to borrow by way of purchasing securities. They then use the surplus to pad their budgets. The current problem is that we no longer have the surplus building to pad the budges with...

    I'm not arguing against Social Security here, just being realistic. The only real problem with the program is the XXXXXX running it.
    "You're too stupid to be saved." -- EasyRider.


    "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
    Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
    Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
    Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
    Epicurus

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xcaliber View Post
    Not true, Social Security is currently running in the red. Benefits are paid out each month with what revenue comes in each month.. under today's current policy there is not enough coming in to cover the monthly expenses therefore they are now draining the trust fund of the surplus...
    Depends if you count interest earned or not. Yes, Expenses are greater than tax revenue but not greater than overall revenue.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xcaliber View Post
    Not true, Social Security is currently running in the red. Benefits are paid out each month with what revenue comes in each month.. under today's current policy there is not enough coming in to cover the monthly expenses therefore they are now draining the trust fund of the surplus...

    Yes Reagan used the trust, As did Bush 1 and Clinton, .. It's the Law. The Money left over after payments are made for the month doesn't go into the trust as cash, the Government is FORCED by the Social Security Law to borrow by way of purchasing securities. They then use the surplus to pad their budgets. The current problem is that we no longer have the surplus building to pad the budges with...

    I'm not arguing against Social Security here, just being realistic. The only real problem with the program is the XXXXXX running it.
    So SSI is about $45 Billion paid out per year
    This is money that comes from the General Fund, administered by Social Security. It is an entitlement program, and most of the recipients never worked. There has been a strong trend for these payment to go to the mentally disabled.
    It is a 'pet peeve' for most Social Service eligibility workers. Lots of waste.

    Would cutting it in half, and putting that money into SS put a dent in the SS running deficit?
    ~ ~ ~

    Hello Steeeve, interested in your input as well.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xcaliber View Post
    Not true, Social Security is currently running in the red. Benefits are paid out each month with what revenue comes in each month.. under today's current policy there is not enough coming in to cover the monthly expenses therefore they are now draining the trust fund of the surplus...

    Yes Reagan used the trust, As did Bush 1 and Clinton, .. It's the Law. The Money left over after payments are made for the month doesn't go into the trust as cash, the Government is FORCED by the Social Security Law to borrow by way of purchasing securities. They then use the surplus to pad their budgets. The current problem is that we no longer have the surplus building to pad the budges with...

    I'm not arguing against Social Security here, just being realistic. The only real problem with the program is the XXXXXX running it.
    Depends on how you want to cook the books.
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

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