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Thread: The Pilgrims Robbed Graves...

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    The Pilgrims Robbed Graves...

    Admittedly, they were starving and desperate but....:
    When the Pilgrims arrived in North America in 1620 they found a land which had already been depopulated by European diseases and which contained many fresh graves. One of their first acts upon landing was to rob an Indian grave. In this act they were following the grave robbing traditions of the Spanish who had arrived in North America before them and they were setting the stage for the Americans who would follow them.

    In one instance the Pilgrims came upon the fresh grave of the mother of Massachusett leader Chickataubut. They opened the grave and stole from it two bearskins which had been interred with the corpse. This did not engender friendly relations with the Massachusett who viewed their actions as a form of sacrilege.

    In another instance, the Pilgrims found a place that looked like a grave which was covered with wooden boards. The Pilgrims dug down into the grave and found several layers of household goods and personal possessions. They also found two bundles. In the smaller bundle they found the bones of a young child wrapped in beads and accompanied by a small bow. In the larger bundle they found the bones of a man. The man's skull still had fine yellow hair and with the bones were a knife, a needle, and some metal items. The grave appeared to be that of a blond European sailor, shipwrecked or abandoned on the Massachusetts coast who had then lived as an Indian. He had perhaps fathered an Indian child, and had been buried in an Indian grave.

    The Pilgrims also stumbled into a Nauset graveyard where they found baskets of corn which had been left as gifts for the deceased. As the hungry Pilgrims were gathering this bounty for themselves, they were interrupted by a group of angry Nauset warriors. The Pilgrims retreated back to the Mayflower empty-handed.
    Native American Netroots:: Desecrating Indian Graves

    Something about American history I just learned today.
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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    Admittedly, they were starving and desperate but....:

    Native American Netroots:: Desecrating Indian Graves

    Something about American history I just learned today.
    I don't see a single source to back up this allegation, neither by you or the Navajo 'writer'...who makes the allegations.
    If one desires to know what the weasel was doing in the hen house, don't ask the weasel, ask the hens.

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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esdraelon View Post
    I don't see a single source to back up this allegation, neither by you or the Navajo 'writer'...who makes the allegations.
    It's something simone wants to believe Esdraelon, so no evidence is required since it feeds her self hatred of America.

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    Lies My Teacher Told Me: Everything Your American History Textbook Got Wrong, Revised and Updated Edition, 2008, James W. Loewn.
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

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    Quote Originally Posted by gansao View Post
    If you were desperate and hungry enough Simone you would take the food from someone elses mouth and eat the boogers of a dead man.
    Seriously?

    Nice. Real nice.
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    Quote Originally Posted by gansao View Post
    If you were desperate and hungry enough Simone you would take the food from someone elses mouth and eat the boogers of a dead man.
    I wouldn't ever be that desperate, but if I were starving, I would certainly raid grain offerings.
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

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    Quote Originally Posted by T.Q View Post
    Seriously?

    Nice. Real nice.
    The reason why I posted this is because a Teabagger ticked me off, a Teabagger who bragged about being a "Right Wing Terrorist":
    Rep. Wally Herger Praises "Right Wing Terrorist" at Town Hall | Video Cafe

    Especially when the Teabagger said to Congressman Wally Herger, California Second Congressional Distrist:
    Wally, my family came over here ... one side of my family ... on the Mayflower ...the first winter was rough, but they didn't have their hands out for somebody to support them ....
    That part about, "they didn't have their hands out for somebody to support them..."

    Like hell they didn't!
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    I wouldn't ever be that desperate, but if I were starving, I would certainly raid grain offerings.
    Murder, cannibalism, eating putrid meat and anything that could possibly have some calorific value or fill a starving stomach has been recorded during famines.

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    Pilgrims Congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    The reason why I posted this is because a Teabagger ticked me off, a Teabagger who bragged about being a "Right Wing Terrorist":
    Rep. Wally Herger Praises "Right Wing Terrorist" at Town Hall | Video Cafe

    Especially when the Teabagger said to Congressman Wally Herger, California Second Congressional Distrist:

    That part about, "they didn't have their hands out for somebody to support them..."

    Like hell they didn't!
    Two general observations:

    1: Must you use the pejorative "tea bagger?" or does the simple mention of the term somehow convey some mystical argument defeating power?

    2: Regardless of how unsavory the means I don't think desperation prompted grave robbing equates to asking for a handout. Presumably the Pilgrims merely took a page from your playbook, declared keeping warm to be a "right" and simply cut out the gubment middleman.
    Mutz (E)

    Your Life Is Not My Fault

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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    Admittedly, they were starving and desperate but....:

    Native American Netroots:: Desecrating Indian Graves

    Something about American history I just learned today.
    First of all the Spaniards only reached Florida and California not the North East coast of the USA. So who were the Europeans who decimated the Indians (oops! Native Americans) before the Pilgrims arrived?

    And about the so called tradition of robbing graves by the Spaniards, where did you get that from?

    All the Spaniards did was ransack whole Indian empires, pillage all their treasure, enslave the Indians into working silver and gold mines and shipped the ore to Spain to waste it in paying for futile wars in Europe, but grave diggers? C'mon!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by E Mutz View Post
    Two general observations:

    1: Must you use the pejorative "tea bagger?" or does the simple mention of the term somehow convey some mystical argument defeating power?

    2: Regardless of how unsavory the means I don't think desperation prompted grave robbing equates to asking for a handout. Presumably the Pilgrims merely took a page from your playbook, declared keeping warm to be a "right" and simply cut out the gubment middleman.
    After Rump Limpballs and his XXXXX followers started calling me a "Feminazi", I was granted a license to call TeaBaggers TeaBaggers.
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    First of all the Spaniards only reached Florida and California not the North East coast of the USA. So who were the Europeans who decimated the Indians (oops! Native Americans) before the Pilgrims arrived?

    And about the so called tradition of robbing graves by the Spaniards, where did you get that from?

    All the Spaniards did was ransack whole Indian empires, pillage all their treasure, enslave the Indians into working silver and gold mines and shipped the ore to Spain to waste it in paying for futile wars in Europe, but grave diggers? C'mon!!
    I didn't know Spaniards were involved in this discussion. How is it that you injected them?
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by E Mutz View Post
    .... Regardless of how unsavory the means I don't think desperation prompted grave robbing equates to asking for a handout. Presumably the Pilgrims merely took a page from your playbook, declared keeping warm to be a "right" and simply cut out the gubment middleman.
    I have no problem with asking for a handout. It is far more honorable than robbing graves, however, if one is starving and knows there are food offerings at grave sites, have at it.

    The big problem is bragging about your ancestors on the Mayflower "who never had their hands out for somebody to support them ...." when that wasn't in the least true.
    Brother, you can believe in stones as long as you do not hurl them at me. Wafa Sultan

    “War is an American way to teach geography,” British soldier

    War is sweet to those who have not tasted it, but the experienced man trembles exceedingly at heart on its approach. – Pindar

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Winston Smith View Post
    First of all the Spaniards only reached Florida and California not the North East coast of the USA. So who were the Europeans who decimated the Indians (oops! Native Americans) before the Pilgrims arrived?

    And about the so called tradition of robbing graves by the Spaniards, where did you get that from?

    All the Spaniards did was ransack whole Indian empires, pillage all their treasure, enslave the Indians into working silver and gold mines and shipped the ore to Spain to waste it in paying for futile wars in Europe, but grave diggers? C'mon!!

    The pilgrims were not the first colonists. You bought into the myth. They arrived 10 years after the first recorded English child was born in Roanoke. They only comprised a third of the passengers aboard the Mayflower.
    " ... It's not as though he proved anything, he only refuted my evidence. ..." Archangel 04.01.09

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    Quote Originally Posted by simone View Post
    I have no problem with asking for a handout. It is far more honorable than robbing graves, however, if one is starving and knows there are food offerings at grave sites, have at it.

    The big problem is bragging about your ancestors on the Mayflower "who never had their hands out for somebody to support them ...." when that wasn't in the least true.
    That thought presupposes that taking the initiative to pluck surplus items from graves is akin to asking for a handout.

    If anything you should be attacking the natives for unjustly withholding warm clothing from the Pilgrims when they obviously had enough to spare. It is a basic tenet of your philosophy that those who have means should be compelled to support those who do not.

    After Rump Limpballs and his XXXXX followers started calling me a "Feminazi", I was granted a license to call TeaBaggers TeaBaggers
    I see, by embracing the methodology of your opponent and adopting the same tactics you manage to rise above them? Your own opponents are thus given license to respond in kind to your ad hominem vitriol. How therefore is the argument advanced?

    There is no surer way of acknowledging the vacuity of your own argument than to resort to name calling, regardless of whether you are a talk show host, a fundamentalist preacher, or a mere muckraker.
    Mutz (E)

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