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God, Santa Clause, the Easter Bunny, et all....: Originally Posted by gansao That is correct but no more precise than I was. The Buddhist sects are sects because they do not actually believe what the Buddha taught. The main tenets of Buddhism do ...
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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2010, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by gansao View Post
That is correct but no more precise than I was.
The Buddhist sects are sects because they do not actually believe what the Buddha taught.

The main tenets of Buddhism do not even refer to a creator God and do not need one.
Zen Buddhism is the nearest doctrine to what the Buddha taught.
Well, the Zen Buddhist say that..

However, considering how long it's been since the Buddha was alive, who really knows? Every variation will say that they are the closest.

Just like every variation of Christianity insists so.
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Easyrider View Post
When did he raise the dead, control the weather, give predictive prophecy, and resurrect himself from the dead?

Isn't 'snakespit' another name for where the serpent Satan dwells?
Unless you are particularly interested in other religions there is nothing much to gain for a Christian to study Buddhism or its history.
If the ONLY way to God through Jesus then Buddhism must serve as a way to draw us away from Christianity.
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From:Kevin Trenberth U.S climate expert.
Date:Mon,12 Oct,2009

The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't.
(In an email debate over a BBC report on the apparent dip in global warming since 2001)
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by trebor View Post
Well, the Zen Buddhist say that..

However, considering how long it's been since the Buddha was alive, who really knows? Every variation will say that they are the closest.

Just like every variation of Christianity insists so.
The Buddha revealed the four noble truths and the eightfold path to happiness.
Look in there all you want ,you wont find a God.
As Buddhism spread it would have taken on some of the regional beliefs.
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When people stop believing in God, they don't believe in nothing—they believe in anything
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From:Kevin Trenberth U.S climate expert.
Date:Mon,12 Oct,2009

The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't.
(In an email debate over a BBC report on the apparent dip in global warming since 2001)
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by gansao View Post
The Buddha revealed the four noble truths and the eightfold path to happiness.
Look in there all you want ,you wont find a God.
As Buddhism spread it would have taken on some of the regional beliefs.
Both God and "Enlightenment" is merely illusions we give ourselves.
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by trebor View Post
Both God and "Enlightenment" is merely illusions we give ourselves.
Actually 'enlightenment' is nothing to do with God or the devine.
It is seeing things as they really are..hence enlightenment.
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When people stop believing in God, they don't believe in nothing—they believe in anything
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From:Kevin Trenberth U.S climate expert.
Date:Mon,12 Oct,2009

The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't.
(In an email debate over a BBC report on the apparent dip in global warming since 2001)
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:33 AM
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Wow, I like the way this discussion continued after I left.

Santa has his roots in religion:
Santa Claus Facts, Origins, Christmas celebration in different countries, and fun Tidbits
The Easter Bunny has his roots in religion, also:
The History of Easter and the Easter Bunny

So, don't be too quick to dismiss them.

I'm obviously out of practice with debating and I remember now why I got away from it - far too time consuming.

The reason for starting this thread was that I am honestly curious as to why humans feel the need to believe in things that are not of this world.
I didn't want to get into my personal business and I still don't but, it's hard for me to make a point without doing so...but, I don't see any way around it.

Before thoroughly embracing the Christian religion which turned me into a raving zealot complete with all of the memorized bible quotes and apologetics, I had always been curious about and open minded to the possibility of 'God'.
I read about Eastern philosophy, studied meditation and at one point believed that I was very close to 'enlightenment'...but, something happened and 'poof' the feeling was gone.

Years passed with no real religious activity on my part. Those years were rough and I was near rock bottom and desperate for help when I started reading my bible, praying and memorizing certain verses to chant to myself when things were especially tough.

It was a miracle! I started to feel better and I made a conscious decision to quit drinking...and I did - just like that, with not another thought about it since.
For about 3-4 years, this went on, trying to be a 'good Christian' (what I thought was a good Christian because after seeing all the arguments from Christians on internet forums, about just what that was, I figured my belief was just as valid as theirs).

I can't say exactly when I stopped 'believing'. There was no special event, no major disappointment that turned me away for a belief in a God, it just gradually happened.

And here I am. I am the same person I have always been - minus an obsession with a God.
I have had some tough times that could have been used as an excuse to blot out reality with booze but, I haven't. In fact, I often go to the liquor store to buy something for my pastry recipes and never once has it occurred to me or, have I had the urge to drink any. I tell myself (and anyone who asks, that I am allergic - and, in reality, I am because I have a terrible reaction to it. )

The point is, I feel stronger now than I did when I was a 'Christian. I am more aware of the world around me and I feel certain that I alone am responsible for what goes on in my life.

When a storm is approaching, I don't look towards the heavens and pray, 'Oh God, help me', I just go to my storm shelter and hope the storm passes me by.
If the weather conditions are ripe for a tornado to form in my neck of the woods, it's gonna happen - because that's the way nature works. if it passes me by, it's not because God pushed it out of the way and if it hits it's not because 'He' allowed it to happen - it's just the weather.

There are so many contradictions and absurdities that occur when you decide to give 'God' credit for everything. If both the Titans and San Fransisco pray to win the ball game, and the Titans win, does that mean that San Fransisco didn't deserve to win, according to 'Gods Plan'?

I know the argument: God has a plan, even though we don't know what it is or, understand it.
Rubbish.
If the Titans win, it's because they have a better team and play the game better than their opponent.

So, back to the original question: Why do some (a lot) of humans feel the need to believe in something that does not exist in this reality?
Why do they need to believe that someone bigger and better and omnipotent and omniscient has to be in control?
Everything that happens in this universe can be explained, there is always a reasonable explanation.
Why is it so hard to believe that We are in control of what happens in our universe?

The day I made a conscious decision to stop drinking was the day my life began to improve and all the years of misery were my own doing, also. It wasn't the prayers or, the bible-reading but, my own determination and willpower. I give credit where credit is due. At the time, I thought it was God, but, now I know that all I had to do was decide for myself.
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by pappillion001 View Post
You are aware that one cannot raise oneself from the dead.
I don't believe you on that. Jesus is God and never died spiritually as far as I can see, so he could do all kinds of wonders if he wanted.

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Originally Posted by pappillion001 View Post
I would agree that Buddha was not a good comparison. Krishna or Mithras would be much better. Both share many of the same characteristics attributed to Jesus and both came before him.
Scholars like Nash and others have looked into that and found Jesus-like comparisons with Mithra bogus. You don't see those simularities before Jesus' time. There was no physical resurrection, no virgin birth, etc., etc.

You haven't done your homework again.
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Old 02-23-2010, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by gansao View Post
Actually 'enlightenment' is nothing to do with God or the devine.
It is seeing things as they really are..hence enlightenment.
To believe that you are seeing things are they really are is the illusion. Where did I say anything about it being divine?

God is an illusion too..
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Old 02-23-2010, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by trebor View Post
To believe that you are seeing things are they really are is the illusion. Where did I say anything about it being divine?

God is an illusion too..
You seem to link enlightenment with divine powers.
Enlightenment is not 'seeing things'.
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From:Kevin Trenberth U.S climate expert.
Date:Mon,12 Oct,2009

The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't.
(In an email debate over a BBC report on the apparent dip in global warming since 2001)
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Old 02-23-2010, 12:09 PM
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Originally Posted by gansao View Post
You seem to link enlightenment with divine powers.
Enlightenment is not 'seeing things'.
No, it is thinking you are seeing things as they truly are.
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Old 02-23-2010, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by trebor View Post
No, it is thinking you are seeing things as they truly are.
No its not.
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When people stop believing in God, they don't believe in nothing—they believe in anything
G.K.Chesterton

From:Kevin Trenberth U.S climate expert.
Date:Mon,12 Oct,2009

The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't.
(In an email debate over a BBC report on the apparent dip in global warming since 2001)
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Old 02-23-2010, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by gansao View Post
No its not.
The fact you disagree means you buy into the illusion.

All is illusion. Even the concept of 'enlightenment'
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Old 02-23-2010, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by trebor View Post
The fact you disagree means you buy into the illusion.

All is illusion. Even the concept of 'enlightenment'
Your post is more Zen like than you realise.
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From:Kevin Trenberth U.S climate expert.
Date:Mon,12 Oct,2009

The fact is that we can't account for the lack of warming at the moment and it is a travesty that we can't.
(In an email debate over a BBC report on the apparent dip in global warming since 2001)
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Old 02-23-2010, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by gansao View Post
Your post is more Zen like than you realise.
Perhaps, but I too am under the illusion. To think I am not would be the height of Hubris.

Those who think they are enlightened, aren't. Those who are actively seeking it are seeking to stroke their ego.

People will be looking for enlightenment.. and just as they think they got it, their ego will come along, pat them on the back and say 'pretty good'\
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old 02-23-2010, 12:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Sandycane
The reason for starting this thread was that I am honestly curious as to why humans feel the need to believe in things that are not of this world.
I didn't want to get into my personal business and I still don't
I don't know about anyone else, but I never ever felt the need to believe in things not of this world. Beside, God is of this world to the extent that He owns it, He created it and He is ultimately in control of it. Also, why do you believe that just because God isn't real to you, that He isn't real at all? How arrogant is it of you to assume that just because you haven't experienced Him in a real and personal way that He must not exist at all?

I say this because I'm here to tell you that I have experienced Him in a real and personal way, so I know beyond any doubt at all that my God, the God of Israel, Yahweh, El-Shadai and Jehovah-Jireh is a loving and personal Father who wishes that none should perish but all of us should come to a personal knowledge of Him and fellowship with Him which is why He created us originally. That's right Sc, God created us for fellowship and He gave us the free will to accept or reject Him.

You seem to have made your choice and for that I mourn you, but if the best response you have to my testimony is that I am using well known catch phrases as if that negates them from being absolutely true, then you are simply deceiving yourself just as every other atheist has their own personal reason for mocking, scoffing and rejecting that which they are incapable of grasping due to a spiritual blindness which prevents you from seeing what we believers see so clearly.

Here is my testimony and the testimony of every other believer who are strangers and aliens in this world as children of the most high God of Creation.

1Pe 2:3 if you have tasted the kindness of the Lord.
1Pe 2:4 And coming to Him as to a living stone which has been rejected by men, but is choice and precious in the sight of God,
1Pe 2:5 you also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house for a holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
1Pe 2:6 For this is contained in Scripture: "BEHOLD , I LAY IN ZION A CHOICE STONE, A PRECIOUS CORNER stone, AND HE WHO BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED ."
1Pe 2:7 This precious value, then, is for you who believe; but for those who disbelieve, "THE STONE WHICH THE BUILDERS REJECTED , THIS BECAME THE VERY CORNER stone,"
1Pe 2:8 and, "A STONE OF STUMBLING AND A ROCK OF OFFENSE"; for they stumble because they are disobedient to the word, and to this doom they were also appointed.
1Pe 2:9 But you are A CHOSEN RACE, A royal PRIESTHOOD , A HOLY NATION, A PEOPLE FOR God's OWN POSSESSION, so that you may proclaim the excellencies of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light;
1Pe 2:10 for you once were NOT A PEOPLE, but now you are THE PEOPLE OF GOD; you had NOT RECEIVED MERCY, but now you have RECEIVED MERCY.
1Pe 2:11 Beloved, I urge you as aliens and strangers to abstain from fleshly lusts which wage war against the soul.
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