Faster than seasons.
Originally Posted by DrNo
And how do you suppose kids are supposed to learn how to dress appropriately if they've only been wearing one thing for a long time?
The problem is your view is lmited because you haven't yet experienced the real world. High school is nothing like the real world. When you go to a job interview, if you show up in all black with a mohawk and a spiked collar, you probably aren't going to get the job. People aren't going to think of you as "emo." They are going to think of you as immature and stupid.
Well then, we had a little misunderstanding.
Again, your frame of reference is kids. I'm talking about preparing kids to be adults in our society. Right now, our system treats kids the exact opposite of the way they will be treated as adults.
Well, it could be worse, but it sure as hell could be a lot better. But then again, how far do you want to go with "whatever means necessary to help our kids be educated"? To the point of all liberties stripped? To the point of reverting back to corpral punishment? Maybe holding guns to their heads? Theres a common sense line that needs to be drawn.
Actually, it isn't narrow-minded thinking at all. I'm looking to the future. The two main purposes of school are education and preparation. We are doing a terrible job with both.
And who says that holding kids at gunpoint won't make them more productive? I sure as hell think it would.
Are you saying you don't want schools to create productive, educated adults?
First of all, you can't compare the Japanese to the Americans. There is a HUGE cultural difference, and that would be like comparing an apple to an orange. Just because you like the taste of the orange better, doesn't mean the apple is bad. And to support my hypothesis, i bring up the gun issue. They have the most draconian gun laws in the world, and they have low crime. People draw the conclusion that less guns mean less crime, right? However, in Switzerland theres an AK in every house, and they also have very low crime. The states in the US with most gun control are notorious for crime. There is so much contradiction, that you can only draw the conclusion that it is due to cultural differences. I'm fine if you compare states educational test scores, but it means nothing to compare a foreign country.
I am saying Japan has a nationwide school uniform policy. The kids don't complain they are being forced or oppressed, and they score higher on tests than Americans. You figure it out.
I agree, however you're not going to get fired or kicked out of school if you dress a bit different than everyone else. A job is awhile away from school, and you can't necessarily treat kids as full grown adults. They are not extremely different, but they are somewhat different, with different interests. Adults don't care AS MUCH about what they wear as kids around middle and high school do.
Are you a woman? Seriously. I go to work 5 days a week, 8 hours or more a day. I don't socialize with people when I'm at work. I am expected to be clean-shaven and well-dressed when I am work, as I am a representative of the company. This is the situation in the majority of decent jobs you will find. School should be looked at as the first step towards a professional environment.
No, because school is a necessary part of life. It helps prepare for later in life and is good for you. Uniforms serve no purpose, are stupid, and the only conclusion I can draw from them being forced on us is that it is a control thing.
No, that is what you told yourself. If you feel controlled having to wear a uniform at school, wouldn't going to school itself make you feel controlled?
Administrators and teachers are the equivelant of bosses. They, in this case, would be my boss. Bosses aren't superior to you, they just tell you what to do. Thats their job.
That is a sad argument. I really don't understand how you think if you are wearing a uniform your opinions suddenly don't matter. In case you didn't realize, teachers and administrators ARE superior to you.
You obviously don't understand kids very well. I am someone underneath what I wear, but no one else will know that unless i strip naked and carry around a megaphone shouting about myself. Like they say, pictures say a thousand words. In this case, your clothes would be your picture.
The problem is that you don't understand this. It's also sad that your clothes affect your self-esteem. Are you really that shallow? Are you nothing underneathe the clothes you wear?
Is that your best response?
You may as well just have typed "blah blah blah" here. It could have saved me some time.
You're comparing a kids clothes to drinking, smoking, and porn? If you're going to play it that way, show me specific evidence that show devastating physical and psycological impacts of dressing without uniforms, impacts as harmful as smoking and drinking and porn.
You're right. It's their bodies. We should go ahead and get rid of all the limits we impose on kids. Let em drink and smoke and buy porn! Why not? It's their body! Let's allow the kids to decide everything about school.
And that is my problem with the public educations system.
I'm not sure the point you are making here. Taking in information, processing it, and spitting it back out on a test is exactly what kids do in school.
Wrong. I had a choice to do my homework. I chose to do it, and I'm pretty sure that was the right choice. I had a choice after school to eat junk food after school today, but I chose not to, and I'm pretty sure that was the right choice. I am faced with choices all the time, and most of the time I make the right ones, and when I don't, oh well, it sucks for me. But adults make wrong choices too. Kids judgement isn't as good as adult's, but that doesn't mean we always make wrong choices.
Wrong. Kids make bad decisions no matter what. It doesn't matter if you are strict, a pushover, or somewhere in the middle.
I'm running on advice from my parents. Unless they're somehow kids in disguise, or are retarted (which i'm sure they're not), i'm pretty sure I'm making the right decisions. When I make bad decisions, i know within a week. However, I guess we'll see in 10 years won't we?
Kids are immature, inexperienced, and horrible decision makers. Brilliant kids with loving parents shoot up their school. Yous also pointed out the other problem. Kids like you think you are mature and make good decisions. Guess what? Most kids think that way. Ten years from now, you will look back on decisions you thought were good and say to yourself, "I can't believe I did that." Everybody I know has.
As a side note, it may surprise you to learn that I went to my senior prom dressed like a punk rocker. I had a ripped turquoise suit with safety pins all over it, spiked bleached hair, and Chucks. The next Monday, I had a teacher who I had never had a class with come up to me and say, "My wife was talking about you all weekend long." The point is, the reasoning behind me wearing that was to basically give a big middle finger to the school. I guess deep sown inside, I just wish kids had some pride in their school and could actually get a decent education. I felt that public school had let me down, and I was angry.
The bottom line is, the only somewhat-decent argument I have heard against school uniforms is that it violates freedom of speech. Interestingly enough, this came from the girl I went to the prom with.
Although the first story is not an uncommon one in our society, I think you have the uniform thing backwards. If a new law is coming into place, such as an abortion ban, a gun ban, etc. The question is usually not "why not?" its "why?". The same goes for a uniform policy. Why? What purpose would they serve? If they prepare kids for later on in life, how do they do it? Where are your stats to back you up? What are your arguments? That sort of thing, plus, what do the people say who are disadvantaged or hurt by this new policy/law? They should have some say too.
"They keep talking about drafting a Constitution for Iraq. Why don't we just give them ours? It was written by a lot of really smart guys, it's worked for over 200 years, and [heck], we're not using it anymore."